99 - Interview with Brett Bentman

This week, we interview prolific writer, director, producer, all around nice guy, Brett Bentman of B22 films. We discuss his films, the industry and more. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:37

You know what I'm in the mood for, Isaac? What are you in the mood for, Derek? For my childhood to be thrown into the gutter.

SPEAKER_05 0:44

Let's twist it.

SPEAKER_03 0:45

Let's twist this childhood. Throw it out into the universe. Do you know who my favorite childhood character is? Garfield. Do you know who my second favorite childhood character is? No, Derek, who's your second favorite childhood character? Betty Poop, man.

SPEAKER_08 0:59

Betty Boop!

SPEAKER_03 1:00

I don't know if I've ever told you this. I frickin' love Betty Boop. You know, we could go see boop. When she Oh my gosh, yeah. You brought back a meme from like 17 years ago.

SPEAKER_05 1:09

I love it. It never leaves my brain. I'm plagued by it, actually. Anytime there's anything Betty Boop anywhere, we could go say boop.

SPEAKER_03 1:16

Um I love her hair. Uh-huh. And the fact that she goes boop-a-doop.

SPEAKER_05 1:22

Well, tell me, tell me in the ways you love Betty Boop.

SPEAKER_03 1:24

And I love appealing to you. She is a singer in a band. Yeah. Okay. This is good. She's related to Jesse's mom.

SPEAKER_05 1:32

Yeah. You know what I love personally is the fact that she started off as a dog, as a dog woman. Yep, she did do that.

SPEAKER_03 1:39

Which automatically makes her hotter.

SPEAKER_05 1:41

I didn't know that. For the longest time, I didn't know that she started off as the girlfriend to a dog character named Bimbo. Did you know that? I feel like you can't say that. I think so. I feel so too.

SPEAKER_03 1:52

Do you know who my third favorite the list goes down?

SPEAKER_05 1:56

So the hierarchy currently, Garfield. Garfield. Betty Boop.

SPEAKER_03 1:59

Betty Boop. And then Minnie Mouse. And then Minnie's Mouse. No, no, no. Minnie Mouse. Minnie Mouse. Like a small mouse. Minnie's Mouse is a very different person. And what do you love about Minnie the Mouse? I love that she's married to Garfield. Nope. Love that she's married.

SPEAKER_05 2:16

You've heard it here, folks. Here's your latest tabloid. It spins in. Garfield and Minnie Mouse spotted together. Mickey terror. Mickey depressed.

SPEAKER_03 2:26

Mickey's sitting there with Mickey's sitting there with Pluto and Odie.

SPEAKER_05 2:32

And Odie's got the both of them. I guess that's fair because in this sense, Odie's been wronged a little bit too much. I think Odie's always had a little bit of a thing for Garfield, right? So to see him running away with Minnie. And that's, you know what? Subverts the expectation. It's a cat and a mouse running away together. Oh, that's hot. That's crazy. Usually cats eat mice, and maybe that's still true. Moving on. Moving on. What a start. What a beginning. What a way to start. What a way to start this year. Welcome to 2026, guys. We're a little ways into it. And with a new year comes a whole new slew of new public domain released uh IPs that people are completely open to bastardize and twist and ruin and upset the wonderful family, nuclear families of the world by taking characters like Betty Boop, like Minnie Mouse, and putting them in a horror setting, much like the Winnie the Pooh Blood and Honey.

SPEAKER_03 3:28

So yeah, when we were we were settled. Oh, well, I'm Derek, by the way. Oh, but I'm Isaac, and this is That was Horror Bull.

SPEAKER_05 3:34

This is our podcast where we do our best at reviewing the worst in the horror world.

SPEAKER_03 3:40

Thank you very much for joining us. I feel like we should phrase a little. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We we review movies to see if they are worthy of their bad reviews. Yes, right. That is what we do.

SPEAKER_05 3:50

If you're if you're new here, you may not have caught our spiel on that already, but like this the purpose of this podcast is not just to bash movies that have already been deemed bad in the public eye, right? Because that would be boring if we said, hey, this movie that people said is bad, it's bad. Guess what? It's not what we're here for. We are here to check it out and see, dig through that that dollar bin at Walmart and see if it's good or bad. We'll talk and discuss. Well, and like at the end of the day, even the worst movie I've ever seen, and there have been a few that we've watched just for the sake of this podcast. This is episode 99, dude. Yeah, at the end of the day, I will still say, hey, people got together, then really put together their brains and their creativity and made a movie, which is more than I've made. I've made zero movies in this current day. So like they've done more than I can do, even if it's awful. So I still support the fact that people put their creativity to the test and don't just say things and get up off their butts and do shit and go make a movie. Let's make a movie. Exactly. I want to make a movie. Even if you're making, you know, the the what Ice Cube's War of the Worlds 2025.

SPEAKER_03 4:52

That's the best movie I've ever seen. So I don't know what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_05 4:55

If you're going out to make an American werewolf in in Paris, you don't know. You talk about my Lord and Savior in that way. If you're going to make a slender man, you know, all these movies that people have said are not that great, and we kind of agree on that. Like it's still, it takes a village to make a movie. It does. And we I support that.

SPEAKER_03 5:11

We've said for years now we celebrate that. Third year of doing this podcast. We've said for years that there is no such thing as a bad movie. Every movie out there is someone's favorite movie.

SPEAKER_05 5:21

Which you love. I just love to imagine there's a kid who goes to the blockbuster that doesn't exist anymore, and they say, Mommy, mommy, please, I want this one. I want War of the Worlds. It's my favorite movie. Or it's like the only one they ever rented, and they just watch it on VHS over and over. They wear out that tape and it just gets all grainy and distorted.

SPEAKER_03 5:39

So let's talk real quick. So this is a different episode than we normally release.

SPEAKER_05 5:44

Yeah, we're switching up our format deeply for a very special reason. Derek, Derek pulled out on us today. He he really I didn't want to get you pregnant. Thank you. Thank you for not getting our podcast pregnant. No, but we we are pregnant with guests in this situation. Crazy turn of events.

SPEAKER_03 6:00

Yeah, so we we were talking about what movie to watch for episode 99 and then subsequently episode 100 because it's a it's a big deal. Wow, yeah, I didn't realize coming up next is episode 100. Episode 100. Very excited. We need to figure something out because we are at three-year anniversary and episode 100 on the same episode.

SPEAKER_05 6:18

All of the above. Yeah, we gotta we gotta figure out something that's gonna be special.

SPEAKER_03 6:21

It's gonna be cool.

SPEAKER_05 6:22

But we needed a movie for for 99, and then we saw, or at least I had seen there was a post by Bloody Discussion. We both saw it. Yeah. That was like, hey, new public domain horror IP Betty Boop coming to a screen near you.

SPEAKER_03 6:34

And we were like, hey, what about this one? What about this one? So we got together late night like we always do, popped on Amazon Prime and watched the uh Betty's Revenge. Betty's Revenge. 2026. 2026, which turns out it's from B22 Films, distributed by ITN, is that right?

SPEAKER_05 6:51

Who also distributes the uh the also popular blood and honey movies.

SPEAKER_03 6:55

Yeah, so they they also pr uh distribute the jagged edge films. Yes, which is the Pooniverse. Uh which we should just call it Pooniverse, really.

SPEAKER_05 7:04

I love the fact that they they literally start as saying Pooniverse, and then they're like, never mind, that's terrible, it's a twisted childhood universe. Don't say that, don't say that.

SPEAKER_03 7:11

Pooniverse is terrible. I mean, yeah, but everyone's gonna still call it Pooniverse.

SPEAKER_05 7:15

Oh, you can't you can't take that back. It's it's out in the world, there's no way to watch it.

SPEAKER_03 7:20

When you put it when you put the Poon in the Puneverse, you can't just take back the universe. You can take the create poon. Yeah, you can take the universe out of the poon, but you can't take the poon out of the universe. No, this didn't work. No, this is not dumb. We want to get we gotta get people to what they came here to hear. So, long story short, uh, we watched Betty's Revenge, and the day we were supposed to record our episode on it, I was doing my my normal research that I always do.

SPEAKER_05 7:47

Which if you like this, it's it's there's not a lot to find on these movies, right?

SPEAKER_03 7:51

Right? Well, and they just released, they kind of they they kind of shadow drop. I don't know if that's the right word. Like they they quietly drop. Yeah. They don't really put any advertisement in there.

SPEAKER_05 8:00

There wasn't a lot of fanfare. I think honestly, the biggest reason we even heard about it was because of Bloody Disgusting making a post about it. We're like, oh cool, brought it to our attention. And of course, these things are going to catch your eye. People always want to see the next twisted childhood sort of thing, right? Of course. Take X character, put them in a horror setting, you know, you got a beautiful thing there.

SPEAKER_03 8:18

So I I was looking, I was doing my normal research, you know, I was trying to find the budget for the movies, I was trying to find who directed it, who wrote it, all the fun stuff that we normally do. And I wasn't able to find most of that. But what I was able to find was that the director and writer was Brett Bentman of B22 Films, who owns that company with his wife, Tiffany McDonald. Um, and just on a whim, well, okay, first. This is crazy. I was looking at his IMDB credits, and I noticed that he had a lot. I was like, oh man, 74 credits for writer, quite a few, seven for director, uh quite a few for producer, and I was scrolling through just to see if there was any that we had watched for the movie, for the podcast before.

SPEAKER_05 9:01

This timeline of events.

SPEAKER_03 9:03

Imagine uh Sherlock Holmes just webbing together the movie. We went into his mind palace. And I s and I immediately noticed that before the year 2024, he only had like what 15 credits or something like that? 20 credits, something like that. So which means he has almost 40 credits in writing and directing since the beginning of 2024. Just within that year, skyrocketing two years. Yeah. So that's what? I mean, almost two a month. That's an insane amount. That is a criminal amount of movies. Something has to be going on here. But so Derek took an interest in this man. I did, and I I actually reached out to B22 Films on Instagram. Well, I first found Brett, but then his his profile was private, so I was like, ah man, I gotta go somewhere else. And so I went to I went to Couldn't go straight to the source. Went to B22 and I actually just like on a whim sent him in a message and I was like, hey, uh, what's what's the deal? You guys are prolific. This is awesome. I run a little podcast, love to love to ask you a few questions. They responded the next day with like, hey, you want an interview?

SPEAKER_05 10:08

Yeah, Derek was basically like live tweeting me these events like that morning. I was like, on my way to work, I got a text from Derek. He's like, hey, uh, check this out. It was crazy. It was already crazy that he had gotten any kind of response from them at all. Because like, how many times have you tried to reach out to a company and got nothing? Five or six. Because like it was it was the Grinch one, or it was the mean one. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:25

I mean, there has been a few of them. The one I specifically remember was the Grinch. I actually think I did get a response back from that one.

SPEAKER_05 10:31

Yeah, because they were basically like, I got nothing for you. Sorry.

SPEAKER_03 10:34

Well, because I had reached out to the distributor, not the production company. And they were like, we don't know, leave us alone.

SPEAKER_05 10:40

So yeah, it was it was wild for Derek to hear back at all, but then the story developed and continued.

SPEAKER_03 10:45

And so they were like, Well, you gotta check out Minnie. And I was like, Minnie? Oh, what's this? Turns out they also had released a film called Minnie's Midnight Massacre. Uh-huh. Another, yet another IP.

SPEAKER_05 10:57

So now we've got Betty Boop in a horror setting, and we also have Minnie Mouse in a horror setting. Because if you'll remember, there were several movies made at Steamboat Willie's expense, right? You've got Screamboat, you got Mousetrap, which we reviewed for this podcast. And so not a lot of people took Mini into consideration. But you know what? Brett Bentman and B22 films did. They sure did. So then we said, okay, well, we gotta check out Minnie now. We can't see, we gotta finish it out. We gotta do Betty Betty's uh revenge and also Minnie's Midnight Massacre.

SPEAKER_03 11:27

Yeah, so uh we did, and then it turned out Brett was a totally, totally nice guy. He was like, Yeah, I'll come on your podcast.

SPEAKER_05 11:36

Crazy interview. Insane when B22 Films was like, Yeah, you want me to put you in touch with Brett? And Derek's like, wouldn't that be crazy? I'm like, oh yeah, haha, very funny. And then he reached out and then he agreed, and then we set a date to talk, and then it happened, and it's still crazy that this is unfolded.

SPEAKER_03 11:52

It's awesome.

SPEAKER_05 11:53

So basically, the main portion of this episode is going to be our interview with Brett Bettman, who was so kind to be willing enough to talk to us on our podcast here. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:01

And and really, I think that that speaks for itself, and there's a lot of really good information in there. Uh, Brett was super, super fun to talk to. Um, he gives a lot of behind the scenes on how it is to work in the industry, how it is to work for these distribution campaigns. Yeah, very knowledgeable about that stuff. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 12:16

Because clearly he's been been in it for long enough and uh clearly made enough films to know what the hell he's talking about.

SPEAKER_03 12:23

Well, and his and his wife, Tiffany, she actually plays Minnie, the serial killer Minnie in Minnie's. Yeah, she often is playing a role in in the films here. So that multifaceted these people. Lots of lots of talents going around. So yeah, this isn't isn't your normal format. Um, we want to get you over to that interview so you can just soak it all in. It was a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_05 12:41

We've heard enough of our preambles. Time to get into the meat of it. Yeah. And if you want to hear, if you want any thoughts about uh Minnie's Midnight Massacre and Betty's Revenge, go check them out. Yeah. Yeah, go check them out.

SPEAKER_03 12:51

They're on Amazon Prime. I think he mentioned that they were going up on Tubi soon. Yeah, yeah, or YouTube. Or YouTube. Uh just go check them out.

SPEAKER_05 12:58

You will be you will be able to find it.

SPEAKER_03 13:00

Yeah, they're they're the the perfect kind of movie for this podcast. You can sit down with a group of friends and have a great time. You will get some laughs, you will get some fart. Because we sure did. We we laughed a lot, yeah. Uh it was a lot of fun. Um and it is like you were saying, the beauty of like a group of people getting together making movies. Honestly. Um make a thing. Yeah, and we'll we'll talk more at the end after the interview. Um, but it's really impressive the things that they're able to pull out. So without further ado, let's get you over. Our interview with Brett Bentman. Is that is this your wife?

SPEAKER_07 13:34

Yeah, she's running around.

SPEAKER_03 13:36

Yeah, Tiffany, right?

SPEAKER_07 13:37

Yeah, she's casting right now, so she's running back and forth. Oh, that's very exciting, I'm sure. Yeah. Her favorite part.

SPEAKER_05 13:46

There's always there's always something going on. You've you've got a lot that you work on. It's pretty, it's pretty astounding, honestly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 13:51

We can definitely I just got a message from a guy today that uh works with a distributor we work with, and I don't think he understood like how much we actually work because he was like, Man, I just was looking at IMDb, like, how do you do all this? And I'm like, we just have a team, you know, we've got a couple teams. That's very hard to explain it to a lot of filmmakers because they're used to just like knowing a cameraman and doing a hundred percent of the work themselves, but we're lucky enough to have like several people we can call on, or if we have to do multiple projects at once, we can, you know.

SPEAKER_03 14:28

That's so cool. Yeah, that's awesome. Well, uh, if you don't mind, let's just jump into I've got some questions, we've got some questions planned. Um position. Do you want to give this a more like formal introduction before we get going here? When have we ever been a formal podcast? Yeah, that's fair. We've been doing this three years, man. We've never been this formal ones.

SPEAKER_05 14:47

Here on That Was Horrible, have the wonderful Brett Bentman with us. How exciting. Thank you so much for joining us here on That Was Horrible.

SPEAKER_03 14:54

Um, yeah, this episode we are reviewing Minnie and Betty. Yes, Minnie and Betty. Minnie and Betty. We we have watched both films.

SPEAKER_05 15:04

There's a there's a look in your eyes when we say these names. I'm curious how you hold these movies in your heart.

SPEAKER_07 15:11

They're very they're very different. Um one was like something that was very well thought out and planned, and one was like just something that we wanted to do and put it on the back burner for a little while, and then it became very like hot and heavy. Let's get it done as quick as possible. Yeah, I got so curious which is it was very like Mini was something that we had planned for like a year. And I think I think we kept it under wraps for a couple reasons. But one, it's like you know, with these public domain movies, once you announce one, like you just know there's three or four other groups that are just like, oh, we're gonna do that too, and it becomes this mad dash that who can get it out first.

SPEAKER_05 15:54

Is is there a race to be the first one of those out?

SPEAKER_07 15:57

I think so. I think it's um it's more like it's strange to me because you know, not coming, we never thought we'd be doing public domain movies. We you know, yeah, we had our western sci-fi verticals, you know, things like that, drama. And then when I I don't even remember whose idea mini was. It was one of the four of us that came together to do it, and it was like we can't tell anybody because it then becomes like, oh, we can do that. And then before you know it, it it's like this game of like whoever comes out first ruins it for everybody else because that's fair, whether whether they like it or not, yeah, they're not gonna watch another one. That's true, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 16:40

I mean, I feel I feel similarly with that because we've done a couple, like we've touched on the uh the blood and honeys, right? With Winnie the Pooh. And like I don't feel the urge to go watch more Winnie the Pooh based, you know. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:51

Well, and I feel like they kind of cornered the market of Winnie the Pooh.

SPEAKER_05 16:54

I don't yeah, I can't think of any other Winnie the Pooh movies. No, that's true. Yeah, I haven't really seen that many other ones. Though I do think it's really interesting to go for Mini because I feel like when Steamboat Willie came into the public domain, the first thing anybody wanted to touch was Willie himself. You know, you had Scream Bird and another one that we watched, Mousetrap, was it? Yeah, yeah. Everybody touched on just Mickey Mickey himself, or Willie, I guess, and then you guys actually reached in and grabbed Minnie. Smart. Which is yeah, that's smart. I guess nobody else is doing that one.

SPEAKER_07 17:20

Yeah, I don't know if they are or not. And it was strange because the other the other piece of this is you see, like, you know, whether it's Popeye or you don't really see it with the jagged-edged guys. Like those guys in Europe kind of have the market cornered, you know, and the movies are really well done, they're very gory, they kind of have their their people. And so like we knew going into it, we're not gonna be them, we're not gonna try to be them. Okay. It's a completely different, you know, version of these stories.

SPEAKER_05 17:53

But that's a good way to approach it.

SPEAKER_07 17:55

Yeah, and it's like with Popeye, like I know there was a group that did a Popeye movie, get away. And then like an and then another group came and put out like two or three of them before their first one came out. And so we really didn't want to get into like, oh, mini's coming out February 1st, and then someone puts out like three mini movies before before ours even comes out.

SPEAKER_05 18:16

Yeah, you there's a fear you could get lost in that sea of other things. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_07 18:20

Yeah, for sure. And then with Betty, it was like um we had the idea, and then another group was like doing it, and we're like, well, crap, we need to you know get off the pot and and do it. And so then it became let's get ours done, and ours has to be done first. And so that was that was the difference between the two projects, you know. We had a lot more time on Mini to like hone in on what we wanted to do.

SPEAKER_05 18:46

That makes sense. For sure. Yeah, that does make sense. And Betty came out pretty fast. But yeah, you guys are the first this year, I can imagine, as far as the the Betty Boop uh horrors go. I know there's like one other one that I seen a picture from. That's all I've seen from it.

SPEAKER_03 18:57

Yeah, I've not seen anything about it.

SPEAKER_05 18:58

Yeah, you guys got out first though, so that's that's that's great for you guys for sure.

SPEAKER_03 19:02

So you guys have a quick turnaround then?

SPEAKER_07 19:05

Like most yeah, most of the time. Um it's all budget dependent. You know, there's some some larger budget things we've done that we've been able to take like six months to a year to really deep and dive into the edit and the color. And then uh, you know, with a lot of these other projects that are lower budgeted, you know, I can't I can't ask my post team or my crew that we work with all year, year in and year out, to like kill themselves for that amount of money on these lower budgets, you know. But if it's like a vertical project or a project that's you know in the hundreds of thousands of dollars range, then it's like, okay, guys, we expect a little bit more. Um but for the low budget stuff, we we've Tiffany and I have just kind of taken this approach of like, you know, we're not making an Oscar-worthy, you know, Sundance South by film. Let's just have fun with it, let's keep the days short and and let's just keep going.

SPEAKER_05 20:05

Which I think is also important in this industry as a whole is to make things, you know, get it out there, not make it only to make the biggest, craziest, most impressive, most award-winning film. I think there is something important about just saying you're gonna make the thing and then getting getting it done, making it getting it done. Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 20:22

That's kind of I think that's how we've been able to stay busy for the last you know, three or four years is like when an actor joins a project, I think they understand, like, okay, this is about a meteor or this is about a shark or whatever. Yeah, like it's not really what they got into the business to do, right? But the movie's gonna be done well, it's gonna be out quickly, they're gonna have their footage, they're you know, and it's just it it's like I I think Stu once said it's it's kind of like in the meantime productions, it's like everybody's waiting for that, you know, for landman to call or you know, Yellowstone to call. But in the meantime, you know, instead of just yeah, instead of just complaining on Facebook about how there's no work, go out and do something.

SPEAKER_05 21:07

Yeah, I feel like there are far too many people out there who think they're above doing a lot of projects. It's like you need to you need to shag some low balls before you can like you know really shoot for that big thing, you know, that guy's not gonna call right away. You should get some work done, pat out that resume a bit, you know, get some get something up and running. Okay, sure.

SPEAKER_03 21:24

The whole reason I reached out at all is because I was doing research on Mini and Betty. Well, specifically Betty at the time. And and I know you get this question all the time.

SPEAKER_05 21:36

We got house here.

SPEAKER_03 21:40

Dude, your your IMGB in the last couple years, like that is spectacular.

SPEAKER_05 21:45

Over like 80 credits. It's insane. Just like 40 directing.

SPEAKER_03 21:48

But 40 films since 2024.

SPEAKER_05 21:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 21:52

And you say you have a team, you say you're a team, but you're writer, director, producer on all of those, man. Some of those you only have writers. Writer, sometimes you sometimes you only have director. I did my research. Like I just how? What how what are you doing? Are you cloning yourself?

SPEAKER_07 22:08

Yeah, yeah. No, I don't, you know, we've it's just I think it's different. Uh, you know, I came from a a corporate background, um, and then Tiffany comes from the acting background. She was an actor for you know 20 something years, and then there was a time in our lives where we were making movies on weekends, then we were making movies on our vacation, and and I had just stockpiled like tons of scripts, you know. Oh, okay. And because that was like my first love in the business was writing, and then I realized that it's like the worst position to have because everything that you do just gets torn up and told it's garbage, and then never people don't often understand it.

SPEAKER_05 22:50

You can be there on set and they're completely tearing apart the script you wrote. You're like, you'd you'd imagine when you write it out, like this should be this should just read as it is. Yeah, people can read it.

SPEAKER_03 22:58

It doesn't always go there, like take their own direction with certain things.

SPEAKER_07 23:01

It was that my first my first project I ever wrote that had any kind of budget attached to it was this movie called Element. Okay, and it was like a psychological thriller, and I I really enjoyed the script. And I had a production team pick it up, and they got like um uh uh Michael Ironside was gonna star in it, and Christina Caesada. And I was all pumped about it, it was filming in Oklahoma, and I remember they invited me to set, and I went up there, and I was so disappointed because I'm like looking around like this is nothing. None of this is what's on the script, right? Yeah, and uh and the movie was was awful. I thought it turned out terrible, but I forged you know really good relationships with like Michael and Stephen Kazot is a great friend now.

SPEAKER_05 23:45

Yeah, networking is real important, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 23:48

It was like the networking aspect, but I it was at that point I think I was like, I think I want to be more in charge of these, you know. Okay, and um, but how I do it, I don't know. I think it's just like it's just like when you say you're gonna do something, just do it, you know. And um we do a lot of collaboration on set where you know a script to us is uh again, it's all budget dependent, you know, and depending who the financier is, but like with a lot of our lower budget stuff, like we can we can write a 65-page script just knowing okay, it needs to be you know elaborated on set and we'll just come up with new scene ideas and actors can ad lib and and we can draw things out a bit, especially if it involves horses or whatever. Um so like I said, it's like if you're gonna sit there and obsess over the script and write it and rewrite it and then obsess over every portion of the pre-production, you'll never get it done. You know, no, that's not fair. And then, of course, having like Tiffany and and I in the same room in the same office, it's like I can hand the stuff off to her that I can't stand doing, and she can hand the stuff to me. It's pretty nice, and it just goes a lot quicker than if it was just one of us because for a while she was working and I was doing everything.

SPEAKER_05 25:07

Just alone in your writer's room, slaving away.

SPEAKER_07 25:10

Yeah, and and it came to a point where I had been let go from the corporate job because they could sense like I wasn't in it, and so I got pushed over the cliff, like standing there. Yeah, for years you're standing there, like I should jump and just get into film full time, but you're afraid. Of course, I'm gonna lose my benefits, I'm gonna lose you know yeah, and and we have kids, and so um, but when I got pushed off the ledge, then it was time for me to to be like, hey, you need to jump ship, and and and so that was I think in 2023. Oh wow, and so that's why we used to the IMDB job. It was a huge became it became like this is our full-time job that we need to pay bills and eat and support the family. And so there was no uh no other option, you know.

SPEAKER_05 25:57

Oh yeah, it's a beautiful way to go about it. I do love the I do like the the idea of collaboration on set with the actors and stuff because both of us come from an actor's background. We've been in some original productions of certain things, and it is kind of nice to have that like kind of a malleable script, a little something we can work with, you know, and especially a writer, director who is willing to to make some shifts and change and things like that.

SPEAKER_03 26:16

It's very it's it's a nice to hear. Absolutely, yeah. Yeah, so people get so stuck in the way.

SPEAKER_07 26:22

Yeah, and it and it that just goes back to what I said earlier, like we're we're not convinced that the way it's gonna be done is going to change the world, you know. So let's just be open to other ideas, you know, and uh and a lot of times it's turned out some really great stuff, and we've met some really great local actors that probably wouldn't, you know, be working if they hadn't come to our set and we've been able to let them shine, you know. Beautiful. Especially, especially during COVID, I think we were we never stopped filming, right? You know, and you know, that's what we've done.

SPEAKER_05 26:56

All of LA was really shutting down throughout the right.

SPEAKER_07 26:59

Yeah, and we started working with wrestlers and you know, WWE guys during COVID.

SPEAKER_05 27:05

I mean, wrestling's basically like feeds act, it's performing, right?

SPEAKER_07 27:08

Like they're awesome.

SPEAKER_05 27:10

Those dudes are performers.

SPEAKER_07 27:11

Yeah, they're the they're the greatest actors you can have on set because they're they're acting, it's not fake, but it's action, you know, and they're so like they're so flexible because they're used to like, you know, when they win a match, the applause, and so when you yell cut, there's nothing, and they're looking at you. Oh, I'm sure that's strange.

SPEAKER_02 27:30

What do I think something? Yeah, and you're but I bet they have no shame. I feel like if I was a wrestler, I would have no shame.

SPEAKER_05 27:38

You know, they haven't been broken by like the the rest of the industry, you know. You can kind of form them and kind of help them out in this in this new field for them, which is probably pretty fun, honestly.

SPEAKER_07 27:46

Yeah, it was it was a blast.

SPEAKER_03 27:48

So was the fart in Mini, was that was that an ad lib?

SPEAKER_07 27:54

Um crazy. No, it was God. I'm sure that Hannah hates that. Um because it was not there when we filmed it, it was in the edit.

SPEAKER_03 28:04

Oh okay. Sounds good. I guess that that actually technically.

SPEAKER_07 28:08

And I'm not gonna even I'm not even gonna take credit for that.

SPEAKER_03 28:10

Okay, because I wanted three of them.

SPEAKER_07 28:13

That is a Tiffany sick and twisted, you know, hey dark twisted mind. And I'm sitting there like, why? And she's like, it's funny. So I'm like, sure. If you say so, and that's email George and I'll be right back.

SPEAKER_03 28:29

That's the same reason. Oh, sorry, please go.

SPEAKER_07 28:31

Yeah, no, I'll email post post audio and say, hey, Tiffany's part. Throw this in right here.

SPEAKER_03 28:37

That's I I guess it's the same vein as having that guy get pegged in the sex scene.

SPEAKER_05 28:41

Yeah, there's some jam entertaining moments in that.

SPEAKER_03 28:44

That was the idea, and it was it was so out of nowhere.

SPEAKER_07 28:48

I have to tell you, like, I don't think anybody understood what I was going for there. Yeah, even Derek, our you know, executive producer on it, was like he was on set that day, and it was a it was a closed set, so it was just me and sound and camera in there.

SPEAKER_05 29:04

It's a real private affair, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 29:06

And he's like going at it with Indira, and then it's like this whole awkward okay, now you guys are gonna switch.

SPEAKER_05 29:12

And they're like, what do you mean we're gonna switch?

SPEAKER_07 29:15

It was so weird because I think Brad, who was on camera that day, he's like, I don't understand. Does she have a penis? Like he was so confused that I'm like, it's just I'm like, just go with it.

SPEAKER_05 29:26

Just work with me here.

SPEAKER_03 29:27

Trust the process, they're just mashing bits, man. It doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_05 29:30

Yeah, no, but see, it's funny though, because that's something that we we watched the movie and we found a lot of enjoyment out of. Like, that was funny because that really stands out as one of the moments throughout the whole thing.

SPEAKER_03 29:38

This this style of movie, I don't even know what genre to call this style of movie, but it needs those moments. True. I really do think it does. I wanted more farts. That was I would argue that that was my only complaint, is that there was just the one. I was like, give me three. Because then it's like my if we needed more, I needed more release the fart cut of mini because there's something about it.

SPEAKER_07 30:03

Like you have these attractive women and they're farting on screen, you know.

SPEAKER_05 30:07

Something you're not expecting, right?

SPEAKER_07 30:09

Yeah, you know, because I mean the movie is just ridiculous and over the top as it is. So for us to suddenly just take it serious, you know, just felt kind of wrong. Like we, you know, she's doing some horrific stuff in the film, yeah. But it's like, you know, there was something even with like Erin, um who um yeah, she the our our blonde actress, like her death scene is so over the top and ridiculous, and I think some people are like, well, it doesn't make sense. And I'm like, well, it doesn't really have to, you know.

SPEAKER_05 30:41

Don't come poke holes at this. That's not what we're here.

SPEAKER_07 30:43

Yeah, I'm like, it's never gonna be, you know, the boat that doesn't have a leak. Let's just you know.

SPEAKER_03 30:49

That's fair. Who would you who would you say is your target audience? So when you're making a movie like Mini, let's let's talk about Mini specifically. Like when you're writing that script, who are you imagining watching, enjoying, and talking about the movie?

SPEAKER_07 31:04

Yeah, I think that we we had a lot of discussions with ITN with it because you know they're to me, they're the experts. They've they've cornered that market of so many movies, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 31:16

Horror movies, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 31:17

Yeah, I mean, they just that twisted childhood universe is theirs, and like yeah, so we did rely on like Stu and Nicole, like and and Nicole's feedback was always like more, push it, push it, push it, push it.

SPEAKER_05 31:28

You know, so we're gonna be able to do that universe doesn't hold back, so no, but we didn't want to do that, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 31:34

Yeah, we were like, we don't have the budget and we don't want it to be like this gore fist, and you know, so I think when we were thinking about that, we're like, of course, it is targeted to the people that like the public dominion horror movies, whether they watch them because they love them or they'll just like to shit on them online, you know.

SPEAKER_08 31:52

Yeah, for sure, for sure.

SPEAKER_07 31:53

But I I think quickly learned that like they're not gonna like it because it is not like pulling intestines out and stomping on people's faces. But I was hoping that at least they'd like that we took a different approach to it, which I think the reviews have been kind of mixed, you know. Um, you have the the same people that watch those movies don't like it, and then there's been a lot of comments about how like it's a smarter public domain movie than those. I don't mean that as like uh derogatory, it's just not a splatter fest, right?

SPEAKER_03 32:26

That was one thing I took from it, and actually is in my notes about when when we when we actually review it, is I enjoyed the amount of conversation in in the films. It's an interesting. I mean, we see so many of these.

SPEAKER_05 32:39

I mean, we watch the terrifiers, all those it's not just the shock wow where you out factor in all of those movies because a lot of them really rely on that. They do, and it's not always the the most enjoyable movie going experience unless that's all you're there for.

SPEAKER_03 32:52

And I appreciated your your attention to to the story, too. I mean, that I I didn't see that twist coming at the end.

SPEAKER_05 32:59

I it really yeah, I was not expecting Willie to join join it there at the end. That was crazy to me. Great great movie. I also felt so stupid because I'm like the name was there the whole time. Yeah, the whole thing. I really should have.

SPEAKER_03 33:11

We were blind, man. We were completely blind.

SPEAKER_05 33:13

But but here on that was horrible. Obviously, we review horror movies and such. So do you have like an affinity for horror as a genre, like as something you view, or like things you like to direct? Like, is that kind of your wheelhouse or is this kind of new territory for you?

SPEAKER_07 33:26

It I think that's why it's not. Um, I mean, I don't think I mean we'll we'll watch the the horror movies that you know, the horror that's come out as of late, like the elevated type stuff. Yeah, yeah. You know, like we went and saw Long Legs in the theater without knowing what the hell we were watching, you know.

SPEAKER_03 33:45

I mean, who did know with that movie? No, I've seen it, seen it twice, I still don't know.

SPEAKER_07 33:49

Yeah, and I think like Tim and I looked at each other and we're like, what, what that's horror now, you know? And so so we're kind of reluctant to watch a lot of horror movies, you know, but um, it's definitely not my forte. It's not something that I could consider myself doing full time.

SPEAKER_08 34:05

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 34:06

Um they're fun to make. I don't think people realize like how ridiculous they are to make, and it's how unscary it is in real life. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 34:15

That's something I've heard a lot. It's like advice from other filmmakers to like new filmmakers that are like, make a horror movie. Because like you can really you can do a lot with not a lot of budget in horror movies. Like there's so much you can do in that setting. And so much happens in the edit, too.

SPEAKER_07 34:30

Yeah, sure. A lot of sound design. But see, I remember like God, I don't know how what year it was now, maybe like 2018, but like when we did the night before, which was uh a horror movie that we did, like um that came out on Redbox, you know. That's how old it was. And we were all wow. We were like, we were like, oh man, it's everywhere on Redbox. But like you could take 20 grand and get somewhat recognizable name and throw your horror movie on Redbox, and everybody would watch it, you know. But now I think they've gotten so good that it takes a little something more to get the masses to watch it, you know. And the the age of like Friday the 13th is over because to me that's what we wanted to mirror Mini as uh Friday the 13th.

SPEAKER_05 35:17

I was actually gonna ask if there's any kind of inspiration there for the for the movie.

SPEAKER_07 35:20

That that was it, like kids having sex, kids doing drugs, getting killed in the woods.

SPEAKER_03 35:24

Yeah, classically, yay double formula, classic Friday the 13th pegging.

SPEAKER_07 35:29

Yeah, exactly. You know, I mean this mini subsequently is our first like showing any kind of nudity on screen. Yeah, um, you know, I don't know that we've actually done like an intimate scene, you know, before the before Mini. So it was like we're gonna have to go into that territory to sell this. Um, but we had heard like, oh man, don't don't make it like like Freddie or Jason because those are dead. People want, you know, blood and guts. And it was just like, well, this is what we're gonna do.

SPEAKER_05 35:57

Yeah, yeah. No, but I also feel like there is something, there's there's a huge flux of people that love things that remind them of old stuff. Yep. How many movies do we have nowadays that are like remakes or sequels that are all like building on existing brands and IPs and such like that? Like people love stuff that is nostalgic for them. And so, like, I personally would love to see more stuff akin to like the Friday the 13th, the Nightmare Analytics kind of stuff, going back to those kinds of things. I think I think it's great. So if those are things you have interest in making, keep doing it. That's what I see for sure.

SPEAKER_03 36:27

I did notice, I did notice, I I figured your answer would be somewhere along what you said, because on your credits, I mean, most of them are not hoarder. So when when I initially reached out and I was like, oh yeah, love to talk to you. That's another thing that I was so curious about. I was like, wow, such a sharp turn into the public domain horror when you've been doing these like thrillers for so long.

SPEAKER_07 36:49

Yeah, what did we what did we we did? It was weird uh because we had just wrapped a like uh faith-based type thriller and then we like right into Mini, and people were like, What's wrong with you? And I'm like, look, I'm just I'm just working here, you know?

SPEAKER_05 37:09

I'm like I'm doing the work. The distributors want this, and I'm making was that the veil?

SPEAKER_02 37:14

Was that the veil? It was the veil, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 37:16

Which you know, if if you sit through that movie, it gets pretty dark, you know, and so it's not your like you know, fall on your knees and and all that cheesy Kirk Cameron type stuff. There's there's definitely like an evil twist to it, and so uh, you know, but we weren't like advertising, like, oh, the next thing we're doing is uh is a killer mini mouse type movie, you know. We were kind of like, I don't know what we're doing next, you know.

SPEAKER_05 37:41

Which is so fun though. What was it like uh directing Minnie specifically as the killer? Because she was a lot of fun on screen, she was very kooky. Does a lot of that come just from the actress herself, or is that a lot of you like like what's the process there for Minnie specifically?

SPEAKER_07 37:56

When we wrote the script, okay, I had always figured for whatever reason that Tiffany would play Minnie, okay. And I don't even think I told her. And then the process is like, hey, here's our script where Greenlit, the money's in the in the bank, and she's like reading it. She's like, Well, who's gonna play Minnie? And I'm like, Well, you are, you know. She's she always thinks like she can't do it, and uh, you know, but she she was perfect for this because you know, us knowing each other like we do, like I can mentally know how she's going to move and what she's gonna look like in all the black suit and and the tutu, and you know, like she's great at just like pushing limits, she'll do whatever, you know. And so there was never a question of like would anybody else play that role? Yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_03 38:44

Is she right there? Is she she right there?

SPEAKER_07 38:46

She's around, yeah. She's she's hanging around. I was curious listening.

SPEAKER_03 38:50

I was curious if she tapped into any. I mean, have you guys seen Terrifier at all?

SPEAKER_07 38:55

Those I have, she hasn't.

SPEAKER_03 38:57

No, I have not.

SPEAKER_07 38:58

That's why it is weird, right?

SPEAKER_03 39:01

The whole time, the whole time I was comparing you to Art the Clown.

SPEAKER_07 39:04

You're giving very art the clown.

unknown 39:06

Really?

SPEAKER_07 39:07

Because she doesn't speak either, right? He doesn't know completely silent. Yeah. Complimentary. Yeah, complimentary. Yeah, because she was she was pushed to her limit on many though, because it was very hot. Oh, and the mask was very unforgiving. And so, like, we would do things like twice and have to move on because we were like, she's gonna pass out, you know. And uh makes sense. There's one scene in particular where she's like stabbing, like over and over and over, and it was like a hundred degrees out. And the mask had just been freshly painted, so she's like in healing the fumes. Oh my god. And she would like pull the mask out, be like, Did we get that? Because I'm gonna pass out.

SPEAKER_05 39:48

Oh no. See, this is why it has to be the wife. You can't ask anybody else to go through this. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 39:54

Sacrifice. She's a trooper though, because she wouldn't do it again if you asked her to, you know, it's just Are you going to? We would love to do we would love to do a mashup between with Minnie and Betty.

SPEAKER_03 40:07

Oh, very fun. Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_07 40:10

Minnie's full disclosure, I don't know if you watched Minnie through the credits, but there is like a very post- I don't think we did.

SPEAKER_03 40:21

Oh, we're such we're we're the worst.

SPEAKER_07 40:23

We've got to go back to watch it. But it's pointing now. I mean, you can watch it, but it does introduce another character that we'd like to bring into the fold.

SPEAKER_05 40:32

Oh, and who is that?

SPEAKER_07 40:33

I mean, I could just tell you what it is. Yeah, toilet. But basically, like the credits end, and there's a map of the solar system, and we just go through the planets, and when it comes to Pluto, she sticks a knife in the planet. And so we were like, That's fun. She needs a sidekick, and why not? Pluto, which a version of Pluto is now public domain. But we kind of it's one of these things where I've heard there's a bunch of people already doing one. Yeah, it's tough. So I was like, well, what would make more sense to me? Because I thought Tiffany did phenomenal as Minnie, I thought Hannah did amazing as Betty, and I'm like, I have got to get these two on the same team, yes, but then have them turn on each other. That could be fun. And so that's what I would like to do, but I have not been given an okay on it.

SPEAKER_03 41:23

Yeah, you know, you gotta pitch it as like Freddie versus Jason happened. I mean, right? So like Mini versus Betty exists.

SPEAKER_05 41:29

This could absolutely happen.

SPEAKER_03 41:31

Yeah, why not?

SPEAKER_05 41:35

Let them do their thing too, right? Like it's a thing that people definitely want to see. Is it is it tough when approaching these kinds of things to make sure you were going exactly as to what is within the public domain? Because obviously, like Mickey Mouse is not in the public domain, but Steamboat Willie is, right? And especially like it's not like even entirely Betty Boop, it's like the very first iteration of her where she was a dog very first of her first iteration. Is that is that tough for you from like make sure you don't get into the legal legality of it?

SPEAKER_07 42:03

Yeah, you have to clear everything with the lawyers first, and then you're given a very, very strict subset of rules. Like here's what you can do with Minnie. It was so it was so up in the air, like we knew we couldn't put a flower in her hair, we knew she couldn't have any color. Um but then we were like, okay, what do we call her? Because you know, there was this legality issue of the word mouse, you know, and okay, don't use the word mouse. Okay, fine. Then it was like, you can't call her Minnie. And I'm like, okay, and then they're like, well, now you might be able to call her mouse, but not Minnie Mouse. And we were just like, holy crap, it was just so luckily juggling. Yeah, up until like we wrapped filming, we didn't even know what the title was gonna be because it was like, what can we do? Now, Betty was a whole big thing because you know, Disney on one hand knows that everybody's giving them the middle finger by Steamboat Willie, or we need a boot, and they can't do anything about it. Now, with Betty, uh Fleischer likes to sue people, you know, and so like I've heard horror stories of people like I did a Betty Boop uh cartoon in coloring book, and I got a cease and desist, or he's wild. Yeah, and so then it became the lawyers looking into can we even call her Betty? Can we use the word boop? Can we use Betty Boop, you know, which is one reason in the movie we never mention her by name. Yeah, you know, um, because we just didn't know. Well, we're filming and don't know what we can call her.

SPEAKER_05 43:38

That's gonna be terrifying. You really gotta play it safe just so we don't get into that treacherous territory there.

SPEAKER_07 43:43

You know, and even the title, you're like, Well, Betty, or what do we call her? We I think originally it was called Dizzy Dishes because that's what it's based off of that cartoon and people are not gonna know what that is. And then, you know, legal's like, Well, you know, Betty is just short for Elizabeth. So you could just call it Betty because anybody could it was this whole big little work interesting yeah you just get to the point where you're like you guys figure it out and let us know because it changes hour to hour you know I like the subtle putting the ears on her to make her the ear lobe distinguishable to have that look was really neat smart and they were the worst they were the worst prop like they kept I got that vibe because um almost every single shot they're hidden behind her hair.

SPEAKER_03 44:28

I wonder we we kept putting more fake hair over them because we're wait that makes so much sense just cover it just cover because I was there was a time I was like scrolling through and I was like I want to see those freaking ears and the whole time the hair was just always in the way I didn't notice it got longer.

SPEAKER_07 44:45

We just they would not stay on or Sinee was like they keep moving they looked like the you know air pods and then Sinee was like give me that wig and she just kept adding pieces of hair to it you know which helped Hannah because I think Hannah was starting to get like well I don't want to turn to the side and you know it starts to get in the way of your performance right you're distracted by those things you can't just focus on and we just wanted her to do her thing so we were like don't worry about the ears but you know I do know that there have been other like Betty Boop productions that I think haven't done the research to like you know you can't put earrings on her and you can't you know this and that it's very it's very difficult to navigate that. So yeah was it a similar boat when you approached um Aladdin because you just did that one as well right is Aladdin anything crazy about that one as well that one was different just because um Disney is pretty specific on the Aladdin rules you can't have a genie can't be blue can't have singing numbers um easy things art story yeah like they they're very specific on that and Aladdin was um you know we did two of them back to back and um Aladdin was interesting to me because Devanie who was on those she knows how to how to do horror and that was really our first like okay let's try to make this bloodier yeah and so Tiffany and I relied on her to be like you know how many times do you want to stab her? And you know how much blood do you want on your face and lead the charge on this she'd be like just cover me you know and so it was interesting because when Aladdin was finished um the the first one I didn't really care for it. And then I watched the second one and I didn't care for that either and I was like oh man we made two like really stupid movies you know and then and then we put sound design to it and all that and then I was like man I really like the first one. I still didn't like the second one and then when the second one now I'm like I don't know which one they actually are are good movies. Yeah and but we did go back and add more blood and more killing. Yeah you know because Devanie would be like I I would just you know there's the scene where she goes to pull a guy's nose ring out with pliers and we we wanted to like really get there and then stop and it was her idea to be like just let me get the pliers on there and almost yanked that sucker out you know so it was like she really taught us a lot of the ropes on that stuff because we were like and then the funny part is Tiffany came up to me after Aladdin and was like I should have done a lot of that in mini but we didn't know yeah yeah you know even more of a reason growing learning process and even more of a reason to do a mini too bring it up exactly now she's like I I would definitely hold the knife different and I would stab a little harder yeah for sure.

SPEAKER_05 47:40

No that's really exciting yeah that's something I guess you could put forward if you do it do any more of these do you feel like you you would move forward with more I mean I guess you were talking about the potential of like a Betty Mini with Pluto there sounds pretty exciting.

SPEAKER_07 47:50

So you think you would still go forward with more of these we we're we're at this interesting crossroads as a business you know because it has become a business and I think that's another differentiator you know it's not always fun yeah you know and it used to be fun but now there are times where like we'll get in bed at night and be like do we want to do this anymore you know um can we just go back to regular jobs and health insurance and you know all this other stuff and it's tough being an artist a creator making content yeah in any when you do it as much as we do we're you get really burnt out really quick. And so you know we were like okay we're done with westerns for a while. And so that's when the public domain thing took over and then it became like I just had this like underlying feeling that like the business for us is going to change this year. And so we started to do vertical projects and these vertical and I'm like okay maybe this is the shift that I was feeling in my bones about something's going to change but that's kind of not something I can see us doing long term. So long story short you know it was like there are a couple public domain-y type things that are in development now for us. Um but again they're not going to be the terrifiers and stuff so it's a little harder to find the budget and the green light because I think some investors and producers are more like if it's not that it's not a guaranteed hit. Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 49:21

Which is interesting because I I don't I don't want the market to be saturated with the terrifiers. Yeah I think that it's good for those to exist in a small window, a small pocket, you know and then we should have more diversity throughout yeah we we do have one um I mean it's not really a secret but we we do have a twist on Robin Hood.

SPEAKER_07 49:41

Robinhood yeah which I think is equally hilarious as like the name's so good fun and it just has crazy characters you know and um you know and then of course there's the new Hugh Jackman Robin Hood movie. Oh yeah I think it's an A24 thing and it looks so twisted and dark. Yeah it does so I'm like well now is the time to you know do something like this while Robinhood is fresh you know um but it's been a struggle to find the right place you know we thought we had a plan to shoot it in Atlanta and then that kind of fell apart and then new investors and we want to shoot it here in Texas but um and that would have Hannah um involved from Betty as well because we kind of wrote a role envisioning her based off her old character from VHS you know that you know vampire type type thing. Yeah yeah so that would be the only one on the horizon that I can think of um but you know you know we never say never because there's just times when we'll just be like at a restaurant we'll get a call from a distributor and he'll say hey what do you think about this?

SPEAKER_05 50:53

And you're just like hell yeah let's do it and it shifts everything around yeah yeah I'm sure you weren't ever in your life thinking yeah one day I'm gonna make a horror mini mouse Betty boot movie. Like I'm sure those those women on your horizons but some life happens things come in your lap and then yeah you know you get you get a great thing out of it. Like I I noticed um I think it I had discovered um Betty's revenge through a post I think it was Bloody post about it. Do you feel like that really helps that movie get out a bit further than maybe some other ones those guys are great.

SPEAKER_07 51:22

I mean we have never we've never really worried ourselves with promoting yeah okay movies you know um which is it's not entirely true but like earlier on like with 90 feet from home and and copper bill and a couple of these other larger budgeted things you know we would reach out to all these media outlets and be like can you just you know we're having a premiere at the Chinese theater and you know they'll come out and do a little write up but we didn't notice anything until like deadline picked up the mini thing and that went bonkers. Yeah you know like that was the first time that Tiffany and I ever looked at each other we're like oh shit you know like people were like texting us from airports hey we just saw this thing on Skywalk and you know it was like we don't even use Twitter and it was just like Twitter Twitter Twitter you know and then they had gotten some of the information wrong and so you know then it was like a race to get stuff fixed and stuff was just like it's a double edged sword because once deadline or variety picks it up everybody piggybacks off them.

SPEAKER_05 52:26

Yes and so tumbles downwards.

SPEAKER_07 52:29

Yeah and then with Betty the same thing once that was out it was out you know and so to me it makes me nervous because like it's a whole added layer of stress that we weren't used to like yeah it better be pretty good now because millions of people are waiting for it.

SPEAKER_05 52:48

Exactly that was this this expectation set on all of a sudden when before that you guys were just making a film.

SPEAKER_07 52:53

Yeah you know and and then that's just something else to keep you up at night. You know yeah it's true.

SPEAKER_05 52:59

I'm sure you got a lot of sleep this night both you and Tiffany working on all of these projects here.

SPEAKER_07 53:03

Yeah you're just like you know we've been we've been super blessed though to to to have distribution partners that are so awesome to work with but like when you do like a a self-finance movie you know like a copper bill where we're on the hook for the entire budget like you cannot stop thinking about how am I going to recoup this investment. Exactly you know like with you know Mini and and other ones it's like the investment is still smaller but it still needs to be recouped you know and that is something I think that we try to preach to our film community when they come to us is like keep these budgets low because the best thing you can do is is write a check to an investor you know the worst thing you can do is take$250,000 from someone and and write them a check for five grand you know and and then you kill that investor to ever want to invest in anything again.

SPEAKER_05 53:57

Yeah yeah um so it's you want to keep them in your good graces that's for sure.

SPEAKER_07 54:01

Yeah so with Mini specifically because that's one that is you know self-financed with with a partner oh interesting I didn't know that yeah I didn't know they did yeah that was one that like we went to the distributor and was like we would like to pay for it um you know Derek Tiffany and I coming together with with the script and the money and so that is one that even now we're like this movie needs needs to make some money.

SPEAKER_05 54:27

Yeah for sure that's and I think it will you know so now haven't that be a a a self-funded kind of movie is insane. How did you approach like something like the effects in that because I feel like that's something that is always important in horror people want to see those kinds of things whether it's a lot of gore a little bit yeah do you feel like you have a preferred method be it like doing the practical effects on set or going with like the visual effects added in later what do you what are your thoughts on that?

SPEAKER_07 54:50

We did uh Mini was all of the gore in mini was practical. Very fun so we had Aaron come out and basically do a lot of you know uh the blood work and then when we finished watching the movie there were a couple things that we were like that didn't work so then we hired a local um makeup VFX artist named Sinee Coffin and she's great we worked with her a bunch and she came in and fixed a couple things that's cool we reshot a couple things and then uh the whole bit with the sheriff and Minnie uh we completely shot shot that nobody even knew we were doing that. We just added it because she had like this really impressive gore gag on the side of his face that she wanted to use and and so I was like well let's just go you know add it in there. So I I I didn't want to use a lot of VFX and in fact with Aaron's Aaron's uh kill we did have this idea to like you know the the throat gets slit and all this blood starts squirting out yeah and I was like if we can't do it practically I don't want to do it and so you know we didn't we didn't go over the top of that because it just to me looked really fake.

SPEAKER_05 56:04

Yeah it is something that can kind of take you out of a film especially with kind of in the pocket of it you're watching it and then yeah suddenly that's those kinds of things stick out like sore thumbs. And I feel like that's a that's a good approach. Like if we can't do it we just shouldn't probably yeah just leave it.

SPEAKER_03 56:18

Yeah I love that mindset too because you don't expect that mindset from these lower budget films right you don't expect people to be like no we need practical you expect them to be like no I got on After Effects and I added blood.

SPEAKER_07 56:29

Yeah listen on this on this show here we've seen a lot of that stuff yeah sure I mean but it it's uh I'll tell you it it works both ways we learned a really valuable lesson when we did years ago we did these bull shark movies and the idea to that was like we're gonna do a a cheesy VFX shark yeah the movie is gonna be funny it's not gonna take itself serious great and they ended up being very successful all three of them yeah and there's a reason like Shark NATO is so successful right yeah oh yeah you know it's just and those movies were made for like nothing and I mean we had like a paper mache shark Finn and Tom's everyone and I are in the water pushing it and it looked stupid.

SPEAKER_04 57:13

That's so fun though.

SPEAKER_07 57:14

People really like yeah they loved it you know stuff like that oh yeah yeah we just made it funny and fun and it was a bunch of friends making a movie you know all staying together but you know on the flip side of that when we did Lone Star Shark that trilogy we paid to have somebody make us a shark this thing was a fucking nightmare you know and it's like isn't that what they say about Jaws too like the shark was an absolute nightmare it was it was the same garbage like he put he put 150% into making it yeah and it looked great and I it wasn't garbage because of him yeah it was just the process of like there were never enough people to pull it or we would pull it and it would break and teeth were falling out and like poor Aaron was just like look man and I'm like look dude for the budget you did an amazing job.

SPEAKER_05 58:06

Yeah yeah but you know distribu distribution was like you probably should go back to the VFX shark you know which is rough but yeah it's tough it's it's tough to make a good looking shark let alone one that can be in the water and be moved around a lot and do all the things you need it to like it's a pretty it's a tall order and you want it to work.

SPEAKER_07 58:24

And he did it it looked great. I remember day one he pulled up in the truck with it and I was like damn this is a real shark and then we got it in the water and we had every issue that they had on Jaws. Yeah. Every single you know only difference is we had no money to throw at it. Yeah exactly you couldn't just like fix it real quick you like no there was a time we're just fucking there was a time that the shark just was not working that like Tiffany who was producing uh Nathan on sound put his boom down and pulled we had like seven people pulling this damn oh my god pulling people off the street hey you want to come pull a shark yeah and somebody actually came out and was doing a documentary on the making of that oh wow yeah because but I don't think it can even be put out because it was literally like just hours of Tiffany and I bitching and cursing and like I'd watch it.

SPEAKER_05 59:14

That's a where's this shark now?

SPEAKER_07 59:16

What do you do with this physical shark if it uh if it like at the end of the production we we gave it to the owner of the lake it was a scuba diving lake oh cool we gave it to him and he mounted it on the wall hell yeah and it still operates yes I love that that's so sick.

SPEAKER_03 59:34

He was gonna leave it he was gonna leave it at the bottom of the lake that would be cool for scuba divers yeah like he but he was worried that like scuba divers would get freaked out yeah you know of course because it did look real it was just um it was the nightmare so that's so fun yeah that's such a good story though so okay a couple more things i i'm curious after all of this is there an IP out there that is not in the public domain that if it if it entered the public domain you would drop everything for like what's your what's your like bucket list the horrifying public domain that's a good question I I don't think I've ever thought of that um if I could it's not a it's not a public domain thing but you know I Tiff laughs at me and thinks I'm a nerd but like science fiction to me is the simplest thing to write.

SPEAKER_07 1:00:30

Yeah which is strange because I don't come from a scientific background or I just find it immensely fun to like look at some science and then twist it. And I don't know if you guys have ever heard of this movie or seen it but there's a movie um called upstream color. Oh no I have seen that one now it's it's not everybody's cup of tea but it's to me one of the better science fiction movies I've ever seen. Okay. Because it's so many crazy ideas and then he did one called primer that was also good I saw primer I did primer primer was good. Again like not everybody's cup of tea because it's like real science. No if I could make if I could have like a real budget and make a space movie like not like a Star Wars movie but like you know have a full spaceship set and everything that I think we could do some really good damage um with like um one of my favorite space movies called Sunshine the Danny Boyle movie like I would love to make a movie like that where it's very uncomfortable and claustrophobic and you know but rooted in like actual stuff. As far as like the IP stuff I mean I have a feeling in years to come once a lot of these Marvel guys hit um you'll start seeing Superman oh yeah I didn't even think about that you're so like I think King Kong is coming yeah you know that's fair yeah I really don't see any of that as like attractive to me. Yeah um but I do think I mean I know we talked about this but I do think that the Betty mini mashup um which I won't give away the idea but like I do think that we have a really solid idea for that.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:15

No I think that's great. I'm I'm excited to hear for it.

SPEAKER_07 1:02:20

I believe in that one so it is something we've talked about you know as as a you know a couple like do we believe in it enough to pay for it ourselves um that's another tough one because like I think I've only ever made one movie where I was like I believe in this enough to put everything we have into it. You know um we didn't and I wish we had because it's massively successful but yeah um I do think that the I think what what distribution everybody's waiting for is to see how these two do.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:54

Yeah that's fair.

SPEAKER_07 1:02:55

You know they're doing well but that's because they're on very limited streaming platforms. I think this month when they hit tube and YouTube that'll be the big telltale sign of like okay the masses want more or not.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:08

Yeah you know and speaking speaking on the masses when when things like Winnie the Pooh Blood and Honey came out and all these other kinds of like you know childhood characters that people have loved growing up go into a horror setting there's been a lot of backlash to a couple of those people are really really mad to see Winnie the Pooh tearing into each other. Have you have you received any kind of like similar backlash with like Minnie and Betty Boop like people being upset about this kind of stuff?

SPEAKER_07 1:03:31

Yeah not a ton but I think we have gotten some emails and messages about like how could you take a sweet you know innocent mouse and do this and how can you make Betty an American icon oh my you know and so you just kind of have to you know we have pretty thick skin yeah of course I would assume from years from years of reading letterboxed and you know oh man I'm sure yeah as filmmakers that's gotta be tough.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:57

Oh man sometimes it makes me laugh yeah but I've been going through looking at reviews of like movies that I enjoy I'm like this is what people think about this but I can't imagine if I made the movie.

SPEAKER_07 1:04:08

It's tough you know and and we have a lot of of uh hate out there and there was a time when I would really get worked up about it and I would respond to things and Tiff would be like what are you doing? It's tough to get bogged up by that. Yeah but there are there's still times when I'll I'll start an argument you know just to be like if it's something that I just feel like okay now you're just being you know rude to be rude. Yeah for no reason right yeah like I I always have a a a problem with IMDB like you know I'm glad they've gone to the 250 word review but like it's not a review when you're just like the writing sucked the movie sucked the acting suck. Yeah like you're not that's really reviewing the film you're not saying anything.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:51

Yeah you know so I wish they would do a better job at you know circulating who who can actually leave a review and who can't you know so well it's all subjective to I that's I mean we've been watching movies for three years together and it's so crazy to me how some people can say that. Like it's such it's such but then you see like the behind the scenes you know you see friends making a movie pushing a shark in a water you know like that's so amazing to me.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:15

I think it's also funny every time you try to approach people like that it's like what would you do different like okay you go make a movie. If you know so much about it then you go make a better one.

SPEAKER_07 1:05:24

We would love to I think at one point uh we were at a film festival one time and I think it was for a western we had done and you know the western world has their own film festivals. Yeah yeah I bet they if anybody tears a movie apart really well it's a western aficionado really yeah oh man blue cowboys that's the wrong gun those are the wrong bullets he didn't wear a holster like that doc holiday didn't speak like this you know and you just have to stand up there on stage during a QA and take it you know yeah yeah that's uh but there was a time uh at one of the Larger film festivals were showing Doc Holiday, and Tom Zembrod, who played Doc Holliday, is like very intense with his research, and he did everything the way you know. And someone in the audience was like, Why was he wearing that holster? Everybody knows Doc Holiday and wearing that holster. And I think like either I'd had too much to drink or just like I said to the guy, like in front of everyone, I was like, if I would have known that you were there when Doc Holiday was alive, I would have hired you to come on set, you know, and it was just like everyone looked at me.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:33

I'm like, that's so good. Oh no, that's fantastic.

SPEAKER_07 1:06:38

That is the whole subjectiveness. Like, nobody was there, nobody really knows, you know. And um, but I mean, I haven't seen a lot of that on the on our films like the Aladdins or Mini or anything, but we definitely catch a lot more crap on the on the Western movies.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:55

Right. Interesting. Yeah, I didn't know the Western people were so serious about that. It's intense.

SPEAKER_07 1:06:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:01

I know if I'm ever approaching a Western project, I gotta be real careful.

SPEAKER_07 1:07:04

Yeah, and it's interesting to me because you look at like Quentin Tarantino, right? He'll take a movie like Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, an actual event, and he'll change it and nobody gives a crap. No, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:16

There's a lot of that's fictitious, right? Like if you're making a$25,000 Western and you're in this film, like they're gonna roast you on the spin right there. Goodness. Yeah, that's amazing. It's wild.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:31

Well, Brett, thank you so much, dude. You're awesome.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:35

That's really fun. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:37

If you ever come to Utah, because we're located in Utah, please. We will go to Utah. Uh we're both like right in the middle. Yeah, like central Utah. 20 minutes south of uh Salt Lady.

SPEAKER_07 1:07:48

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:48

So if you're ever down here, just hit us up and need us some actors for a project.

SPEAKER_07 1:07:53

Shark like I'd love to shoot a western in Utah.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:58

Do it. That's where it's done. We can both be cowboys. Yeah, we're actors.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:01

We'll be careful we're the right kind of cowboys with the gun, the holster cowboy's everything.

SPEAKER_07 1:08:06

It's just it's wild. You gotta experience it at least once.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:11

Yeah, well, and it's it's one of those things I would love to be. I've never been in a film. I would love to be in a film.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:17

We've done all stage stuff for our career, so we'd love to do something like that.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:21

Hearing stories and talking to directors, it's so amazing the things you guys do. And honestly, I'm very impressed with what you guys have put out and and in the manner that you have to put out, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 1:08:33

Yeah, I appreciate it. I mean, we we don't envision stopping anytime soon, you know. I think you know it's just it's a crazy business. It's there's nothing else like it. You know, it's you know you can be in a room with a thousand people and you just know in the back of your mind if someone went around that room and asked everybody what they do for a living, there wouldn't be another person in there that does what we do. Yeah, it's it's just a crazy way of thinking about it. You know, like there are times when people be like, oh, you know, I work for you know uh IBM, or what do you do? Oh, we run a production company and make movies, and they're just like, What? You know, so we try to take advantage of it because you know it's it's not gonna be here forever, we're not gonna be here forever. Um so you know, we don't envision that stopping. We just kind of want to keep going and doing the next thing, you know, which is the IP horror movies that I think was the next thing, but I just know there's gonna be another next constantly evolving and changing, you know.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:39

Things new things come and go all the time. So maybe we'll do space movies, maybe space movies, you'll get the chance to make your sci-fi. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 1:09:46

Well, there's there is a lot of like this AI stuff, yeah. Um, which, you know, not to go into that, but I have a very different take on AI than most filmmakers. Um I love it, you know, and and it affords low-budget indie filmmakers to do things that they never in their wildest dreams would be able to do. Right. Um, so I do think there's a feature in B22 to do some uh some AI type theatrical stuff. Um but I fully fully know the shitstorm of hate that's don't look at those letterbox reviews. You know, but the trick will be can we do it in a way that nobody knows that yeah, this or that part of it is AI, and we just keep your head down and keep going and see what happens.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:34

Well, and I'm sure I'm sure a man like you with the the practical mind, right? Talking about all those practical effects and everything, I'm sure you would do it respectfully. If that's the vibe I get from you. So yeah, you know anyone's gonna do it.

SPEAKER_07 1:10:47

Yeah, I don't think that um I I'm writing something right now, and and today I wrote a line, you know, like the Big Bang happened. But if you think about it, something or somebody had to have their finger on the other side of that. Nothing can just happen. Yeah, I think that's what a lot of people fumble with AI, like it's just gonna take my job, you know. Well, you have to learn how to use that tool and be on the other side of it, you know, to get it to do something for you. And I think people are just happy to sit there and go, oh, there goes my job, you know. But in our case, like I started taking classes and went to school, and it's like I'm gonna learn how to use this tool so that we can be on the other side of it to have it work for us.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:32

Yeah, you know, because it is a it is a force. I mean, it just takes going anywhere. Yeah, it's it's it's being implemented in my job. I'm a chef. It's being implemented in my job, it's crazy. So yeah, way to ride the wave. Yeah. Better to be better to ride the wave than be consumed by it, I guess. For sure.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:50

Exactly. Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:51

All right. Well, Brett, thank you so much, dude.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:54

Yeah, thanks for taking the time to chat with chat with us here on our little podcast. Really appreciate it. It's been great to have you time. Thanks for making these movies. Excited to see what else is coming out for you guys. We'll keep watching Aladdin one and two as well. Like, I haven't checked those ones out yet.

SPEAKER_07 1:12:08

Yeah, you'll have to let me know what you think of those. Very different take on the stories.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:12

Yeah, yeah. Very cool. All right, Brett, we'll take care.

SPEAKER_07 1:12:14

Thanks, guys. Yeah, thank you.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:19

Oh, those those poor boys. What a guy's making what a time.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:26

No, that was that was a lot of fun. That's amazing. That was our interview with Brett Bettman. It was just such a joy. Thanks. Thanks again to him. Yeah. If he listens to this, you know, just for spending the time because he had mentioned at the top of the interview, he was like, Yeah, we just got back from like a pro a project, basically.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:41

They were out of the country. No, they were on vacation. That's what it is.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:44

Yeah, they literally and then got back and then agreed to do this like the next day. Well, why would they do that? Thank you so much for doing something like that.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:51

I mean, there's something to be said for like I love it when we meet people who are passionate about their art. Yeah, like they do this as their career, but they also they love making movies. Yeah, and you can really feel that in the way he talks about them and the way in the way that they do them.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:04

It's really inspiring to hear him talk about like how he was at that point in his life where he was like working a full-time job and like making movies on the weekends, right? Like instead of taking a vacation, he would go take a trip like someplace didn't film a movie, right? Like that's really and he had to take that moment where he's like, Okay, I'm on the precipice here, I need to jump in and make this my career. And so, like, you know, it's an inspiring story. And then you can have you, you know, if you find yourself in a situation like that, but then perhaps you could also find yourself with, you know, over 70 credits on IMD pack, seriously.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:33

Um, so I did want to break something up. Uh multiple times during that interview, he brought up a thing called verticals.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:38

I didn't know what that was.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:39

If you're not familiar with that, you don't spend a lot of time on like TikTok. Those are like those TV shows slash movies that play exclusively in the real vertical format, the REL vertical format. Um, they're usually weird. I don't know. The ones I've seen have been weird.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:57

It's strange, it's a weird thing. It's also like I've come to notice, somebody pointed this out to me that like you'll notice in a lot of like mainstream modern shows. Have you ever noticed they are framed certain ways so that way if you were to take a click a TikTok clip of it, it would fit well in the vertical setting. Somebody pointed that out with stranger things. I'm like, oh my god, everything is like in the center of the screen right there. So if they have to take a clip from it and post it on a phone, it fits in the vertical frame. It's strange.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:23

The world now matters time. Yeah, they look at things like dropout, that entire thing builds revenue on like TikTok. That's true. So it makes sense. But anyway, yeah, that was that was so much fun talking to him. And after we ended the interview, we actually ended up talking to him another 15 minutes.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:37

Super nice guy. I like I I I I was I was a little anxious just to be like, you know, this is the person who's done a lot of stuff. It's just like when we when we originally talked to Lex Hogan, like at the top of our podcast, right? I was like, this person is in the industry and knows their stuff, and we're just two guys with microphones who have a podcast. But no, it's it was really, really cool. He was very kind.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:57

And and again, so many thank yous to B22 Films and Brett and Tiffany as well for allowing this to happen, giving us the space to talk about this.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:06

It's great.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:06

If you found what he thought what he was saying interesting, go check out his movies. Um, go check out Aladdin. We will be watching Aladdin together.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:13

Aladdin one and two, also like basically Aladdin in a horror setting. Yeah, check out Betty's Revenge, Minnie's Midnight Massacre, you know, they're basically exactly what you'd expect going into like, you know, oh, public domain horror movie kind of thing. You know, if you can wrap your head around that, you know, get some friends together. I think you will have an enjoyable time. I think you'll have a good time.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:32

And there's nothing like watching somebody toot when they're walking up the stairs. Yeah, I can't stop bringing that up.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:37

And that's all we have to say about that, because you know, it happens, and we talked about it in the interview as well.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:42

No, but it was it that was such an amazing uh experience. I'm excited to be able to interview more people in the future. I thought that it was just a great time, hoping we get to do collab with them in the future. That's the dream. Yeah, that's the dream right there.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:54

Catch us with me in catch us in the next cowboy Brett Pentman when when he does the Garfield slash mini.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:00

There it is.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:02

That's our in. How uh Google, how long until Garfield is in the public domain? It's probably a ways out ways. It's not in our lifetime. We will have to make our own like spoof Garfield and just like uh narrowly make our way through the copyright law to get around it.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:19

No, but this was fun. It was it was really cool to peek behind the curtain on these uh like lower budget films. Yeah, you know, like they their budget self-funded films are like wild. We we've watched a lot of them for this podcast, and and to actually talk to someone who is at the forefront of producing these films, like producing a ton of them. Yeah, it was really, really fascinating.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:41

So yeah, no, I really I really love that angle of it, getting to see like behind the lens on how these things come about, you know, what these what the process of it is like and how these uh you know that entire turn of events is deeply interesting. So yeah, I hope you guys found the the interview interesting and you like that.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:54

Yeah, and that is really all we've got for you this week. Uh tune in next week for our episode 100. My god. We'll see what we'll do. I just got chills and sweats thinking about like, oh god, we gotta we gotta make this important. Uh we will be uploading that full interview, just the interview portion to our YouTube account as well with video if you wanted to go see our silly little faces.

SPEAKER_05 1:17:19

But yeah, and stuff. Thanks for tuning in. Uh as always, our filthy with you. Stay speaking.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:36

If you like what you heard, leave us a review, drop us a like, give us some recommendations on whatever you do stays.